Using Midi Record to record layer + layer

Got it working :grin:

Getting some stuck-on notes like you were though, so a bit more playing about required. Iā€™m already on testing branchā€¦ just trying a software update.

The only problem I have with the testing branch is shutdown from the gui. On my build the zynthian.sh script recieves a 139 exit code because for some reason the python script doesnā€™t completely exit cleanly. For now, until the fix gets merged to the stable branch I added another stanza in the zynthian.sh script
for shutdown. Copy the case 0 stanza and add it for 139.

You might not have the shutdown problem.
I would test first.

Hereā€™s something I worked on last night, using the midi layer record method, starting with the bass line first, added drums. I am not sure why but I find it a lot easier to start with the bass line. Itā€™s easier for me. If I start with drums, sometime I overthink it and get the rhythm wrong. If you are bored listening to it, fast forward around 3/4 of the way through. It took 2 synth instruments to make a similar sound to the original recording of The Way by Fastball.

I might try changing the instruments and synthesizers used a bit, and redo the drums a bit.
After that Iā€™ll record the lead, not sure if I am going to sing it or not. Either that or find a synth instrument that will sound wellā€¦ and then play the solo on the keyboard.

Iā€™m going to look for USB foot switches. I think a foot switch setup for play/record will work out well.

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This is what I use . . .

Lowercase r for Toggle Record Audio
Uppercase R for Toggle Play Audio
lowercase c for all notes off.

https://www.amazon.co.uk/DecentGadgetĀ®-Control-Keyboard-Action-FuƟpedal/dp/B00O055QB4/ref=sr_1_45?

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Awesome! Where did you buy the Foot Switch from ?

Itā€™s a mystery!

Hereā€™s the same song with the lead track I recorded. I figured out how to use a leading drums track for the delay between hitting the delay and record buttons.

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Just submitted a feature request for trasposition in MIDI recorder playback . . .

Awesome!

I have added some questions to @wyleuā€™s feature request as well as a possible (although maybe irksome) workaround for MIDI transpose. I have also suggested a method of implementing where we allow insertion of MIDI LV2 effects around the SMF player which would allow for various transformations including transpose. (I think something similar was done for audio recorder.)

I would actually like to see SMF recorder / player and step sequencer to be combined into a single MIDI sequencer with record and playback features. The base design is almost there in the sequencerā€™s Arranger view but some functionality is missing (although recorded as feature requests in issue tracker). Although we can already import SMF into multiple patterns and record live into a pattern I would like to see the ability to treat the Arranger view as a mini DAW with live recording of long patterns and import / export of whole SMF. (Import works already.) If we added these features then the workflow discussed in this thread may become obsolete as you could just prime a track and record directly into the sequencer. Allowing the sequencer to be wrapped with LV2 plugins may add extra functionality without the need to specifically add it to the sequencer, like global transpose.

We have often discussed how much DAW functionality should be built into Zynthian and have generally avoided too much but there are some things that we are already quite close with so maybe we can nudge that way. Who knows, maybe a replacement audio recorder may integrate with the sequencer at some pointā€¦ Watch out Protools!

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Iā€™d love to see a simple multi track midi recorder implemented on zynthian :smiley:. Like @riban says, a lot of the bits are already there in the midi record/playback and in the stepsequencer. My parents had a clavinova which had a 16 track song recorder built in. It was fairly basic but covered all the basics and was great for throwing together song ideas, and even stretched to making simple arrangements. It was definitely not a full blown DAW or midi editor, but was surprisingly powerful all the same.

I think there is a justification for two different MIDI record playback frameworks.
The one press record simple tool ( with bpm /transpose on playback)
The much more powerful sequencer tool.

I would offer up the traditional disinterested user who is intimidated by more functionality ( I might break something) but who has a very clear idea of simple demand ( I just (yes that weasel word ā€¦ :slight_smile: ) want to record some MIDI)

The present MIDI & Audio record started and stopped on a toggle switch without any GUI change ( except the red circle) once again doesnā€™t intimidate the disinterested user.

Perhaps making the recorded file(s) easily available in the sequencer/arranger might address both use cases.

How it presents to the user is different to hope it is implemented. It may be possible to provide a simple UI for the described workflow or we may find it an overhead to implementation that is not beneficial. We can look at both options. I am keen to reduce the quantity of modules and simplify workflow wherever possible but obviously not at the expense of usability.

Certainly loosing two primary menu items to Audio Recorder and MIDI recorder is probably an incorrect level of attention to play them.

I think we should record a MIDI track every time the audio recorder goes into record as a matter of course and to allow synchronization and annotation of events.
Sony did a nice box for producers that displayed in picture timecode and a switch to enter events and it churned out an Edit decision list that allowed structure to be extracted from the miriad of video chunks over enthusiast, under experienced camera people used to generate.

The dilemma with these mechanisms is the difficulty of a successful recording. What do I do next? Because of the free form recording mechanism the next thing you are trying to do is establish a sync point to hold everything together. The temptation to reach for a drum machine quickly reveals the difficulty involved but the tempo control aā€™la the MIDI recorder is actually a good concept as it is an issue at the right level of the creative process. Transpose seems a similar concept to operate at this point, as these are overall concepts in our arranger object model.
So we are asking the user for the key & the tempo. Good clean musical concepts that donā€™t involve flashing screens and technical intimidation.

Simply going into MIDI record should generate a new track if the MIDI sequence is playing transposed.

Implementation would best be placed in an lv2 module as this seems to be as much of a lowest common denominator as we have, and makes components more re-usable, both from the perspective of the component itself and quite how we implement devices that produce MIDI streams are implemented. We have some interesting questions still to address in Audio routing, the MIDI equivalent could become something that would probably best live out in the webconf world with the GUI handling configured setups.

Thought, is cheap, and I really donā€™t think itā€™s more than a tweak to the existing infrastructure, if we are to completely replace the MIDI recorder with the sequencer then this doesnā€™t warrant too much endevour, but perhaps we can pose some questions about where we see MIDI stream handlers doing in our refined universe.

Ribanā€¦ what works for me is using the Worlde Easycontrol for record/playback. I just either have a long lead in base or drums to sync up with that I edit out of the audio recording. I think Iā€™m going to graduate to switch pedals. How well does a usb hub work with MIDI ?