Issues with first run (no sound, no webconfig...)

Ok.
Yes it can all appear intimidating. You are also combining several different fairly involved technical skills, all of which have a considerable bearing on the final outcome.

But you have a raspberry pi ? ( It is a model 3 at least is it.?)
You have a hifiberry DAC out card that has worked with the raspberry pi and speaker test has run successfully?
So that is a good starting point.

You say you have the screen and the encoders interacting properly. Congratulations! that is a considerable part of the functionality Working and altho it doesn’t make any sound does provide a health check. Incidentally was this with the Encoder board connected? If you did say I apologize but I don’t remember if you mentioned it.

The networking side is also awash with traps. Suffice to say if the great and the good were starting the Internet from scratch there would probably be several changes that would be made and networking would probably be fairly high in that list ( If you want purest insane why did we do it that way have a look at email).

But you are past that hurdle because you are using Putty and webconf, so there’s another couple of bit that are playing correctly. Again congratulations.

It would probably be a good idea to try building it from scratch on the bench bit by bit to. It would at least allow detailed pictures of the encoder board, which works ( you can operate encoders and it shows up on the screen) but personally I’d love to see a detailed picture of that board to see how everything looks.( After all that is the component that is most ‘personalized’).

I have built many many zynthians in all kinds of forms using different audio boards, displays and encoder configs. The early efforts were frustrating in the fashion you describe but we get there, and try to roll as much back into the process to help people further on down the line.

You seem to be a little daunted by the commands you are typing. It’s certainly a horrible feeling typing weird incomprehensible bits of magic text into a terminal and very disheartening when the spell doesn’t work. Again this is all done at a distance so we are making a best guess but you actually sit at the reactor whilst we only watch the atomic explosions from a distance.
A few useful things to know.

Audio on Raspberry Pi’s is a complicated system there is.

  1. Alsa The bit that handles the audio hardware. When you use speakertest or aplay or aconnect you are dealing with Alsa commands and these are good confirmations that wires aren’t crossed and things are as they should be. THere isn’t really an Alsa server that runs but obviously the Alsa code has to be correct to make it all work… Much of computer programme is indivdual chunks and they all make a lot of assumptions about what is available and if they don’t find it then tend to sulk with obscure lines about Dbus or can’t find . or some such. But you say speaker test works …but next we come to jack . . .

  2. Jack An Audio server and a very good one. This is where the magic goes on it allows various Audio & MIDI devices to work together. but it is a completely different component from Alsa althou it uses Alsa to transfer good audio data out to Alsa which interfaces to the hardware. There is a Jack server and this is started at startup and it has to be running for good stuff to happen. The normal way of checking this is a tool called qjackctl which people who use remote linux machines to log on kind of just works but if you are using a windows remote machine you need a component, which I know is mentioned in another of these threads elsewhere (xming seems to be the way to get X-Windowes on windows.) That will tell you if jack is running properly and what it can see in the alsa world. BUt what started the jackd server , well it’s something called …systemd

  3. Systemd the start up beast operated by its command line systemctl. This is a long list of instructions on what to do to start up the bits and pieces that are required and also check to see if some bits are already available before thinfgs start and its a great way of starting a row in the many many bars that Unix people retire to after a long day of frustration. What is does allow you to do is start and stop individual components and get the status. The zynthian has several components that run to make it all work and some them will continue to run whilst others are restarted. This is what people mean by a system so you can stop the zynthian component with systemctl stop zynthian. But you don’t need to restart it using systemd and indeed this is the way we run the system to see what kind of error messages the indvidual bits are producing because a ‘normal’ zynth doesnt produce logging because with the ssd disk on a pi this is a fine way to clutter up the disk and corrupt ssds.

I have to go out now but I hope this in some way explains a bit of the magic you are typing. Apologies for the tome, you sound very frustrated and I certainly know that feeling but, remember this is not a personallised bug set aside for you, it’s just a piece of technolgy that has something that prevents it behaving correctly and once it’s fixed it will not remember and will work blissfully. The down side of this is you wont remember the fault so when it reoccurs on your next zynthian you will have to come back here to remember how you fixed it.

Just like toothache…

Keep at it!

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Wow… thank you for all this, it helps a lot (if not yet to find solution, at least for the morale !)

I love technology, music, sarcasm and irony, so don’t worry about my despair, i continue to think that i’ll not be beaten by a machine (I AM YOUR MASTER, DEVIL BINARY THING !)

In fact i learn more with trial and error and solving problems than reading long treaties (not that second is unuseful but a bit boring for an old learner and experimental addict), so here i learn… a lot… really, a lot (more than i expected !).

This being said :

  • hardware : is the complete kit ready to mount (RBP3B+, HIFIberry DAC+, AIO, knobs kits etc.) so i guess it’s not a variable in the equation (it’s fully functional with other OS, it’s a fact now)
  • “health check(s)” : done with and without the encoder board connected. no noticeable differences in results.
  • AIO image : i’ll post this tonight, but to be precise i controled every point of solder and tested continuity almost evrywhere with multimeter (i didn’t find the schematics to go further).
    If it was a real analog device i’ll have check with audioprobe but here it seems not needed because, well, digital !
    I’m just not sure (and don’t know how to control) for the microchip. Maybe electrostatic discharge have been acted on it ? bad bended leg ? but all the controls work and all legs are fully in contact with the pcb (controlled one by one) so how to see more…
  • Alsa : regarding all the control commands done, seems okay (everything is in place, no volume or mute)
  • jack : thx for explanation, that’s the part where i needed some light, i understood the role of the guy, but not how to control him eficiently. I’m gonna dig a little (better than random commandlines ^^) and look at qjackctl
  • Systemd : nice infos, it gives light again and help with seeking bug, but i’ll need to dig here too to understand more

Anyway thx again for your time, really appreciate it, and be sure when i’ll find the culprit, i’ll be back to explain how to start fire under the stake !.. IF i understand how to, for sure !

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the AIO “naked”

My friend, your AIO board looks really fine. Anyway, i’m pretty sure that the problem isn’t there. That’s my proposal:

You send me your zynthian. I’m really curious about it! Your case is not very common and i want to know where the problem is:

  • If it’s my fault: some part is broken or documentation is confusing => I pay the shipping costs
  • If it’s your fault: you make an error or miss something that is well documented, etc. => You pay the shipping costs
  • If it’s a bizarre problem and it’s difficult to say who is the “zokete”, the we pay 50-50.

What do you think? :wink:

Seems fair… i’ll give myself à couple of days to dig more, and tell you.

Anyway, i just noticed the schematic in wiki page (didn’t scrolled enough…), i don’t think its related with my little problem but i’m intrigued :
There’s this 4 pins connector on AIO wich obviously is this same schem’s switch 4 pins but it is not described nor present on photos or the wiki guide.
What’s his purpose ?
Thx

So… i’ve been wandering linux’s forums, HIFIberry’s forum, Zynthian’s forum, jack’s forum, blogs, obscure webpages with no name and, still, no clue about my little problem.

If the offer is still on, give me the adress for expertise, i’m in (sad to admit defeat but in).

Thx

Well, until jofemodo is coming back around here, i’m trying to dig again (it is said hope gives a reason to live).

And i’m stuck trying to use qjackctl.

What i’m doing :

  • i’m on Windows (yeah i know… sorry !)
  • started zynthian
  • installed xming to launch x server
  • launched it, started it
  • configured putty in x11 forwarding mode
  • connected to my zynthian as usual within putty (root)
  • tried qjackctl & command

At this time i guess the jackd ui should appear, don’t have abnormal message in console.

But in fact there are 2 windows that appears in the taskbar, but impossible to display them !

One is named “jack audio connexion kit (default) active” the other “connexions - jack audio connexion kit”, but can’t see anything on previews nor to display one !

Don’t know what i’m missing…

Can anyone help me on this ?
Clear procedure to access qjackctl on zynthian ?

Have read the doc from jack and xming and some other sources, but can’t find why i can’t see the jack ui.

Know i’m surely wrong somewhere but… well i definitely suck at this (but i try hard !)

thx !

What did you mean when you said “& command”

Hi @arkhhh!

Of course the offer is on! This is my address:

Fernando Moyano - Made Makerspace
Noguera Pallaresa 59-61
28014 - Barcelona
SPAIN

The best!

Typing the command line “qjackctl &” in putty.
Assuming the fact i’m doing something useful to get gjackctl starting… really unsure about that !

Thx, starting the packaging (guess this is something in my range or expertise !).
I send the whole zynthian mounted, box included i suppose ?

the ampersand & means, that its started in the background.
you don’t need that.
The window titled JACK Audio Connection Kit is the one.
There is a connect button.
That dialog is of interest for us

Okay, thx mate !

Sometimes there’s clever vegan persons who tatoo themselves with japanese ideograms and ended up with “barbecue” on their skin, sometimes there’s part-time linuxians who use tragically inappropriate command lines…

Both come from naïve ignorance ^^

i’ll try again tonight, if it works i’ll post screenshot.

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Tried without the “&” => same result. Impossible to display windows of qjackctl…

Got 2 logs from xming :

first one :

Welcome to the Xming X Server
Vendor: Colin Harrison
Release: 6.9.0.31
FreeType2: 2.3.4
Contact: http://sourceforge.net/forum/?group_id=156984

C:\Program Files (x86)\Xming\Xming.exe :0 -clipboard
-multiwindow

XdmcpRegisterConnection: newAddress 192.168.1.5
winCheckDisplayNumber - Xming is already running on display 0

Fatal server error:
InitOutput - Duplicate invocation on display number: 0. Exiting.

winDeinitMultiWindowWM - Noting shutdown in progress

And second one :

Welcome to the Xming X Server
Vendor: Colin Harrison
Release: 6.9.0.31
FreeType2: 2.3.4
Contact: http://sourceforge.net/forum/?group_id=156984

Xming :2 -multiwindow -clipboard

XdmcpRegisterConnection: newAddress 192.168.1.5
winAdjustVideoModeShadowGDI - Using Windows display depth of 32 bits per pixel
winAllocateFBShadowGDI - Creating DIB with width: 1366 height: 768 depth: 32
winInitVisualsShadowGDI - Masks 00ff0000 0000ff00 000000ff BPRGB 8 d 24 bpp 32
glWinInitVisuals:1596: glWinInitVisuals
glWinInitVisualConfigs:1503: glWinInitVisualConfigs glWinSetVisualConfigs:1581: glWinSetVisualConfigs
init_visuals:1055: init_visuals
null screen fn ReparentWindow
null screen fn RestackWindow
InitQueue - Calling pthread_mutex_init
InitQueue - pthread_mutex_init returned
InitQueue - Calling pthread_cond_init
InitQueue - pthread_cond_init returned
winInitMultiWindowWM - Hello
winInitMultiWindowWM - Calling pthread_mutex_lock ()
winMultiWindowXMsgProc - Hello
winMultiWindowXMsgProc - Calling pthread_mutex_lock ()
glWinScreenProbe:1390: glWinScreenProbe
fixup_visuals:1303: fixup_visuals
init_screen_visuals:1336: init_screen_visuals
(–) 3 mouse buttons found
(–) Setting autorepeat to delay=500, rate=31
(–) winConfigKeyboard - Layout: “0000040C” (0000040c)
(–) Using preset keyboard for “French (Standard)” (40c), type “4”
Could not init font path element C:\Program Files (x86)\Xming/fonts/misc/, removing from list!
Could not init font path element C:\Program Files (x86)\Xming/fonts/TTF/, removing from list!
Could not init font path element C:\Program Files (x86)\Xming/fonts/Type1/, removing from list!
Could not init font path element C:\Program Files (x86)\Xming/fonts/75dpi/, removing from list!
Could not init font path element C:\Program Files (x86)\Xming/fonts/100dpi/, removing from list!
Could not init font path element C:\Program Files\Xming\fonts\dejavu, removing from list!
Could not init font path element C:\Program Files\Xming\fonts\cyrillic, removing from list!
Could not init font path element C:\WINDOWS\Fonts, removing from list!
winInitMultiWindowWM - pthread_mutex_lock () returned.
winInitMultiWindowWM - pthread_mutex_unlock () returned.
winInitMultiWindowWM - DISPLAY=127.0.0.1:2.0
winMultiWindowXMsgProc - pthread_mutex_lock () returned.
winMultiWindowXMsgProc - pthread_mutex_unlock () returned.
winMultiWindowXMsgProc - DISPLAY=127.0.0.1:2.0
winProcEstablishConnection - Hello
winInitClipboard ()
winProcEstablishConnection - winInitClipboard returned.
winClipboardProc - Hello
DetectUnicodeSupport - Windows Vista
winClipboardProc - DISPLAY=127.0.0.1:2.0
winMultiWindowXMsgProc - XOpenDisplay () returned and successfully opened the display.
winInitMultiWindowWM - XOpenDisplay () returned and successfully opened the display.
winClipboardProc - XOpenDisplay () returned and successfully opened the display.

Don’t understand (as usual !)

Couple of explanations and an apology, which I’ll do first. The & as mheldt said puts the task in the background but what does that actually mean?
Well ehen you run a command from the command line one of two modes of operation are possible
1/ running in the foreground:
The command line prompt runs the programme and hangs around waiting for the programme to finish and when you finish it (control-C) is one way of closing it or if it’s a graphic programme like qjackctl then the exit button or the x in top right corner of the window will finish it and you will return to the prompt where you could do something else… or

2/ running in the background . . .
Here the command line prompt starts the programme but immediately returns the prompt so you can run something else, which in the kind of thing we do with zynthians is quite useful, because this way you can run several different programmes at the same time from the one prompt (aseqdump for instance is another programme that will display midi messages that you might get running at the same time for all kinds of reasons ) .
The switch that allows you to do this switch is the &. If it has the & at the end you will run in background otherwise it’s foreground. By in large it saves you having to spin up multiple putty terminals do do things at the same time.

The problem you have seems as you suspect to be an xming problem and I’m afraid I’m not a great help there. You can run a seperate pi indeed a Pi zero-w can be picked up for a very small amount ( do make sure to get the suggested three usb & Ethernet hub to connect it to other things if you go down that route) That does at least allow you to run enough of a linux desktop to do the X-Windowing that way. As to Windows Xming I suggest a hunt of their support fora to get some hint. People have done it so it seems very possible and as with all these things the answer will be obvious once you know it but perplexing until you do.

Hello @arkhhh

So the first time Xming was already running according to the log.
When Xming is started, it starts the display server as a local service.
this service gets a virtual “local host IP” often named localhost or 127.0.0.0

The second log looks like mine, although there are three lines that are different:
winInitMultiWindowWM - DISPLAY=127.0.0.1:0.0
winMultiWindowXMsgProc - DISPLAY=127.0.0.1:0.0
winClipboardProc - DISPLAY=127.0.0.1:0.0

This means my server display runs on the first monitor or video device.

Yours might run on a second display that is activated through your video card.
Just a guess, but do you have a second monitor running?

Greetings and God bless, Marius

Yes. Send me all … :wink:

Hello ! Again : thx guys for the help, but with à last weekend of headhaches i’m done for : impossible to Have qjack showing results (had only one display, tried to do things step by step but failed).
Currently packing zynth for a little travel to barcelona (too bad i Have no vacation ahead, i surely would appreciate to accompany him, long live ramblas !).
I definitely lack some serious knowledge to beat this (i see the stupid mistake coming !)
hope jofemodo will tell us what was the problem (except my ignorance :-))
see you

HI !
Zynthian’s sent, hope for good news soon :slight_smile:
regards

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